⁓ Yeah, you got like, got a real education. ⁓ Awesome background, man. So you worked for Star, for, well with Justin and ⁓ Mina as well, right? Before he came back up here. Well, you did, that was all down, Star was down in, yeah, that's right. Wait, was there an upland in Miami?
Daniel Siegelman (01:09)
Yup, that's correct. That was all down here. Yeah, all down in Florida.
Yeah, I actually I opened that with Justin as a CDC. Yeah, that was part of my progression with Steven.
Josh Sharkey (01:20)
That's cool. ⁓
Yeah, what was it like working for Steven?
Daniel Siegelman (01:26)
It was intense. He is, you know, when he walks in, it's almost like a thunderous cloud walking in. You just kind of like...
Oh God, here we go. And you know, he's going to nitpick everything and, but it's all for the right reasons. Food, everything, everything tastings with him. We're just, you your hands get, your hands get clammy. You know, every, all the corporate chefs are just like running around crazy. But, you know, he was, he's one of the most special people in our industry. I think for sure. It definitely changed the lives of a lot of chefs, managers, really set the tone. So I was very grateful to be able to be a part of his program.
Josh Sharkey (01:39)
Food too? Like, food, he'll... Really?
He's one of a kind, for sure. What about Mina? How's it like working for him? I love Mike.
Daniel Siegelman (02:06)
yeah, for sure.
But that was a lot of fun. He's like a walking party. He just likes to have a good time. Cook good food. He's always smiling, always joking around. ⁓ When push comes to shove, he'll throw down. He'll jump in line with you, which is great. But he's quite a character. He likes making cooking fun.
Josh Sharkey (02:17)
Really? That's so funny that...
It's funny, I had him on the podcast and then we did a panel together in LA. he's one, right away when you meet him, you're like, he cooks. You know, you're hearing his voice, like he's not a, you know, he's getting on the line sometimes.
Daniel Siegelman (02:44)
yeah.
yeah, absolutely.
Josh Sharkey (02:52)
⁓
So what are you doing now? I mean, I know you're at this new restaurant group. Like, how's that going?
Daniel Siegelman (02:57)
It's good, you know, it does definitely have some challenges like every corporation but you know, I've been Trying to get me's with them for the past year Everything with them is it's very rudimentary But you know
Josh Sharkey (03:08)
thank you.
Daniel Siegelman (03:11)
We do have two more restaurants coming down on the pipeline. So hopefully we can get it up and going with there. I'm really pushing hard. ⁓ So it's, it's great. You know, it's, it's a Mexican concept. We have four locations right now. Very incredibly busy, which is nice. You know, Florida had a very tough off season this year. It was very scary as you probably heard. You know, so Miami, it was very tough. Everybody raised rents. You know, there's, listened to podcasts religiously cause I'm, driving all the time.
So
the rents, the politics of Miami, I'd say there's probably 100 to 150 restaurants that closed over the summer just due to rise in costs. Restaurants that just received Michelin star, James Beard, they shuttered two months later. Very awkward what was going on. So a lot of restaurants are moving up north.
Josh Sharkey (03:56)
Yeah.
Is that because of the water lines
and the fear of flooding and things like that?
Daniel Siegelman (04:04)
No, no, it's just ⁓ everyone's moving to Miami. ⁓ All those big, big technology companies, Amazon, all those places. So everyone's trying to jack off all the rents and, with the margins, it's tough. So rents increased probably by 40 to 60 percent over the past year. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, you listen to the guy in FMV, Just a Tip Hospitality, he's really into it and he's fighting for us down here.
Josh Sharkey (04:21)
Whoa, that's nuts. That's wild.
I gotta write that. What's it called? Just a tip?
Daniel Siegelman (04:34)
Just a tip, it's
quite a name. His name is Felix Bernadeski. He runs FMB Hospitality down here in South Florida. It's a restaurant brokerage. I listened to him. He's in a nitty gritty with the politics of the restaurants and the hotels with what's really going on. He helps restaurateurs find good locations that doesn't have all those backlash things on their...
whatever it is, their leases. So, you know, it's really interesting to hear from that kind of perspective, not just as chefs, but someone on the front lines kind of working with us to see what's really going on with the cities, the politics and how to manage it a little bit better.
Josh Sharkey (05:14)
Yeah, yeah. What's your day to day like?
Daniel Siegelman (05:17)
My day to day, I'm up early with the kids, 7 a.m. usually, 7.30, take them to school. And I two, I have an eight year old and a seven year old.
Josh Sharkey (05:22)
How many kids you got?
⁓ we're
close. I have a almost five and six year old, four and six right now. You take him to school, like no bus, you just drive him? Yeah.
Daniel Siegelman (05:30)
Nice, there you go. Yep,
no buses in Miami. So yeah, I they have like one or two per school, you know those are for ⁓ kids that need them or whatnot. you know it's.
Josh Sharkey (05:38)
Really? Like there's like...
That's why.
Daniel Siegelman (05:47)
Everything down here is all very transactional. So, you know, it's my personal time, my kids in the morning, I see them. That's the only time of the day really I see them unless I'm off. And then I just go straight to work. depending on what location needs me, go, you know, kind of restructure the teams, help, you know, manage techniques, you know, look at some issues with food, work with the ownership and you know, it's probably a 10 to 12, 13 hour day and then do it all over again.
Josh Sharkey (06:15)
How often you doing like R &D?
Daniel Siegelman (06:19)
Not much. have a pretty set menu. We just really focus on consistent quality. But for R &D purposes, I'll play around with a special probably one or two dishes a week. We are looking to reformat our menu a little bit to get more because we've been open for 12 years. it's how do we change with the times? How do we modernize our group? How do we keep up with the market trends and how do we stay ahead of the line, if you will? So I've been playing around with a lot of different
different foods on the weekends, running specials, kind gaining some feedback on our guests, and just kind of playing around with that. probably four to five dishes a week I play around with.
Josh Sharkey (07:00)
What
are some new things you're messing around with?
Daniel Siegelman (07:04)
You know, so I mean, we're a Mexican concept. Everything is tacos, tequila, mezcal. The brand is called El Camino. ⁓ So I've been playing around a lot with late night menus, ⁓ kind of trying to drive that business at night.
doing like Alita's, like basically chicken, Mexican chicken wings, but with like a salsa, macha, pickled chilies on air, just kind of, you know, doing our version of it, ⁓ really old fashioned. So it's like the triple wing. So you have the wing, let the drum and the flat all connected. So it's super rustic. ⁓ I went a little bit nostalgia for some of, ⁓ you know, our age people, you know, I did a really, really cool seven layer dip, just playing around with like stuff that we'd have leftover at night, make it really cool and like unique. So when you take a bite, it like brings you.
Josh Sharkey (07:35)
nice. Yeah.
That's awesome.
Daniel Siegelman (07:49)
back to like you know I'm 11 years old watching a Super Bowl so that kind of fun stuff.
Josh Sharkey (07:54)
Dude you
know it's funny like salsa macha doesn't get enough love. It is such a good sauce Especially when you like good it is such a fucking good sauce, you know It's almost like what like the chili crisp did for you know for like Asian cuisine but like way more depth and it's got way more depth and It's so good, especially when it's like done really well It's it and it works for so many things. I love Mexican food by the way. I almost open a restaurant before
Daniel Siegelman (07:58)
No, it doesn't. It doesn't. It's really good. ⁓
Yeah, absolutely.
Mumafu go yeah
Yeah, all agreed. Everything.
Josh Sharkey (08:23)
before I opened up my spots in Brooklyn and I was obsessed with, I spent a bunch time in Mexico and ⁓ man, the food, people are like, I don't think enough people realize the diversity of Mexico. It's like India, there's just so many different, like Yucatan is completely different from Guerrero or from Oaxaca and they're all so different, very cruise, they're like such different cuisines, the North is completely different.
Daniel Siegelman (08:30)
That's cool.
No, they really don't.
Yeah.
Josh Sharkey (08:53)
You know, there's wildly different cuisines, but like so many, you know, great ingredients. People just, you know, they're just used to, you burritos. There's just so much depth to it.
Daniel Siegelman (09:03)
Right, think Taco Bell Chipotle and South the border or on the border is a typical Mexican restaurant. But like you said, when you dive into it, the world is endless with their chilies, the produce and you go town to town and how they make their mole versus one mile down the street, how they make their mole. ⁓ It's really unique. So we're blessed to have a good team that really they love to craft. ⁓ We do have a lot of South Americans that work with us and Mexicans that work with us. So they really they dive into it hardcore.
Josh Sharkey (09:14)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Daniel Siegelman (09:32)
⁓ They're showing us stuff all the time like always what we used to do at home with grandma and it's really unique It's a lot of fun to keep learning every single day Yeah
Josh Sharkey (09:40)
That's amazing too, right? It's because you
know, you're a chef, you've been doing this for your whole life. And you can still learn from these guys, you know, so much because, you know, they have all these little techniques and tricks that their families did for generations. It's awesome.
Daniel Siegelman (09:54)
yeah, absolutely.
I love that. It's a lot of fun.
Josh Sharkey (09:57)
⁓ Where are you getting most of your ⁓ chilis and things like that?
Daniel Siegelman (10:04)
We have a couple of providers that we use that bring them in direct from Mexico.
There's a chili guy out there that kind of ships it out. ⁓ it's two or three brands and the typical chilies we're using right now, we use Cascavels, Arbol, Guajillo, Pesilla, Marita, Ancho, Chipotle. So probably about seven or eight different chilies formulated every single day in all of our sauces. So we do sauce work every single day. Everything is fresh. Nothing lasts on our shelves more than a day and a half. If it is, we just get rid of it. We don't want to keep adding salt or agave.
Josh Sharkey (10:18)
Yeah.
That's awesome.
Daniel Siegelman (10:38)
or acid, just kind of depletes the sauce and the character of the sauce. So everything is, you know, fresh, and true.
Josh Sharkey (10:38)
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, sounds
like these would help their lap, by the way. Making just to run around. ⁓ I mean, the chilies too, like, you know, like for me, like a Pesillo de Oaxaca is like the greatest chili in the world. It is such, and the chilwokle, which is hard to get, like it's really hard to get chilwokles, or at least like ones that are really good and, and, you know, not too dried out, but they're, they're so good. And Morito chilies too, like the little tiny chipotles. Yeah.
Daniel Siegelman (10:48)
If we would.
Super versatile.
Ugh, those are my fave. Those are so good.
Josh Sharkey (11:14)
Yeah, they're so good.
Daniel Siegelman (11:14)
So good.
Josh Sharkey (11:15)
I was like obsessed with making like Chipotle and Anobo at home and how it just like make big batches of it. Honestly, like the fucking can is so much better. I'm like, why can't I make it like the can? Yeah, and it really is. And even like there's like a bunch of brands and I'm like, why isn't mine this good? They're like, you know, it's I think it must be like the whole Heinz ketchup thing. Like there's something about what they're doing in those cans that just makes it. It might be that. Yeah. Yeah. Or some other some other like preservatives, but
Daniel Siegelman (11:25)
It really is. can't go wrong with it. It's the perfect spice level all the time.
Yeah
I think you're just missing a little bit of citric acid. Yeah.
Josh Sharkey (11:45)
I love that man, it's so good. That's cool man. ⁓ I wanna, know, obviously we have this like quick fire thing, but I wanted to get to know you little bit anyways before we get into that. And you had a story that sounds like, ⁓ I'd love to hear too about losing a bag or a notebook or something.
Daniel Siegelman (12:01)
Ugh.
Yeah, so I would just left Napa Valley, came down to Miami. I was the CDC of a very high end steakhouse here in South Beach. And, you know, went out with some friends, went to their houses right when Call of Duty came out and I was 25, 26 at the time. So I called duty. Nothing going on after work. Have a couple of beers. And then there some fireworks going on outside. So we all just jumped outside. See what's going on. It was like two in the morning. It's kind of weird.
And then we came back in and all of our bags were gone. And it was just like, all right, well, I remember my bag was right there. And at this point I had, you know, all my Moleskines in there. I was working on specials, all my recipes from all over Napa Valley, all like those little ticks, the trips, know, everything that, you know, I've worked on for the past probably five, six years just vanished. And I was, I was more heartbroken on the fact that whoever took it,
Josh Sharkey (12:47)
Yeah.
Daniel Siegelman (12:59)
would not appreciate it and doesn't understand what's the value is of those books. Like, give me the books and take everything else. I'm fine. You know, that was probably the most heartbreaking thing about it. And it's not the monetary loss. It's, know, the the history, the knowledge that I acquired through there. And I was just like, well, you know, there's got to be a better way for this. And, you know, sure enough, 15 years later, here you are. I'm like, oh, my God.
Josh Sharkey (13:00)
Yeah, it doesn't matter to them, yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's
literally, that's why I started. It had nothing to do with optimizing operations and shit like that. I mean, we do that now, but it was just like, I don't wanna lose a recipe.
Daniel Siegelman (13:29)
Right. When
I heard your story, I'm like, I like this guy. You know, him and I can connect.
Josh Sharkey (13:37)
Yeah, it's brutal man. It's like if someone steals your wallet and you're like, can you just give me my ID? Just leave the fucking ID because then I gotta go to the DMV. I gotta like do all this stuff Take the money. I'm gonna call for fraud alert anyways, but like just leave that ID ⁓ It's like the it like I wish there was a you know, is it well, no one should ever steal the wallets. Never mind. That's brutal, man. Sorry ⁓ You still have any of your notebooks?
Daniel Siegelman (13:42)
Yeah, seriously.
I think they want to make our lives harder.
Right.
No.
I do. I have a lot. I've redone some. had some, you know, from memory I just jot down so I can have like a blimp of time. And I did start, you know, the free version of Meeze and started inputting some stuff in there and kind of playing, toggling around as I started getting used to what Meeze is actually. And then I just, I was like, hey guys, we got to use this software. It's amazing. So still trying to get it coming.
Josh Sharkey (14:10)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, the interesting thing
is, yeah, I'm sure you guys will. And should talk to Star because they use it. Maybe you guys can swap notes. But I don't think enough chefs realize that cooks, it's free for yourself for life. Just put all your recipes in there. We did that on purpose. I just wanted to have something that's anybody. We work with the culinary schools. We just give it to them. like, just put all your recipes in there.
Daniel Siegelman (14:33)
Hahaha.
Yeah.
It's a phenomenal program. You
did a phenomenal job.
Josh Sharkey (14:56)
I
appreciate it, man. We're always trying to make it better. This year, I think we're, we had a lot of really good stuff on the roadmap for this year. It's like double down on recipes. ⁓ So I'm excited, But thank you. I appreciate that. And Hannah, ⁓ Hannah on our team had very nice things to say about you. So I don't know what conversation you two had,
Daniel Siegelman (15:05)
course.
⁓
We were working all year together trying to trying to get it across the finish line and you know, I just it we didn't make that that last push You know, we went right into what we call a hell week down here, which is between December, you know 20th and New Year's and it's just it's a brutal week It's one of our busiest weeks of the year and then everything just kind of fell off when we got there. So
Josh Sharkey (15:16)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, it's all good, you'll yeah, all good.
⁓ she's great though, and I love her. ⁓ yeah, it's so interesting having like a tech company now, you know, when I restaurants, you know, you have cooks and dishwashers and like, one, you know how to do their job. And two, you can teach them so many things. And, ⁓ so you have a lot more of this onus of like, of how to make them better, how to like grow them. And like, now I have this tech company and, and, I mean, it's been.
Daniel Siegelman (15:35)
she's amazing. She's amazing.
Josh Sharkey (15:58)
five, six years now, so I've learned some things. a lot of these jobs, I don't know how to do their job. So I'm trying to help them, but it's amazing when I see them grow and learn. And it's not me that's teaching everything. I try to give them vision and guidance, but Hannah's incredible, because she's just grown so much with us, I can't. She knows way more than me about her job, and she's really good at it.
Daniel Siegelman (16:26)
That's great. I was going to ask you, like, what was that transition like going from, you know, being a chef into, you know, a tech entrepreneur? It's definitely way out there.
Josh Sharkey (16:34)
Yeah, I mean, it's
funny. You don't know what you don't know. So looking back, I'm like, man, I was an idiot. I should have done this, this, this, this, this, this, and this. And I didn't, you when you start doing something, but like, like anything, if you're going to like, it's funny. I was just having this conversation with my new sales leader yesterday because he's, we just hired a new sales guy. He's amazing. We were talking about rolling out some things and he's like planning this whole thing out.
And I remember the story when I like, at at Danielle. I was like working. I think I was working for Florida. I always always stashed places just to like, you know, just to to learn. And I and I got there and this was early on. like just when I got to New York, was like 19. And the chef, I think it was Olivia, dropped like three boxes of Petit Poix, you know, on my on a table and was like, here, clean these. And so I started to clean them or I started to like, you know, he showed me what to do.
Daniel Siegelman (17:11)
Yeah.
Josh Sharkey (17:32)
And he was showing me how to clean the peri-poi. And I was like, what's the fastest way to do this? And he just said, start. And I was like, ⁓ yeah. And it stuck with me for life. was like, fastest way sometimes to get things done is to just start. And with me, I just did that. I made a ton of fucking mistakes. But I think the hardest part up front was, ⁓ man, know.
Daniel Siegelman (17:45)
Amen.
Josh Sharkey (18:00)
showed all my I was working with all my friends and all my like people on my network to like show them this thing I'm working on and They're not holding back. So there it was brutal. They're like now this sucks like I won't use this You gotta change this this this this and this it was great. It was great feedback I didn't know how to ask for feedback the right way like in software is a good way to do it I didn't know so I just showed him and they would just rip it apart and I felt like Like shit like you're an aft. I'm like, man. This is really hard ⁓
Daniel Siegelman (18:25)
Right.
Josh Sharkey (18:28)
But finally it started to click and I was like, you know, after enough feedback, you know, it was a thing that we could actually use. The tough thing is like, it had to be like easier and better than Google Docs or Google Sheets because that's pretty easy to write a recipe in there. So you have to make it as easy as that, but then all the output. So the hardest part was just like all the, you know, hearing all the feedback from the beginning. But I think now the hardest part is like what I was saying is, ⁓ you know, in a restaurant like
After like 20 years, you just know what good is. You know when like a cook starts, you're like, they're gonna be good. I see how they move. They're quick. They don't know how these things work, but we can teach them, but they're gonna be good. And even like a dishwasher or a busser, you're like, yep, that guy's got it. Or a major D, whatever those things, like you know. In the tech space, I'm like, you know, I have product managers, have like salespeople, CS, marketing, like, I don't fucking know.
Like, I think you're a good person. You have the same principles as me. You work hard. So I have to stick to these first principles of when I think about people, things like curiosity and ⁓ intellectual horsepower, things like that, because I can't suss out, like, are you a great marketer? ⁓ So I have to stick to the general principles. That's probably the hardest part.
Daniel Siegelman (19:25)
You
Josh Sharkey (19:50)
Maybe in ten years I'll be a lot better at it, but like, it's like if you, you know, had to like hire a sous chef and you've never been in a kitchen before.
Daniel Siegelman (19:50)
Interesting.
⁓ Yeah, okay.
Josh Sharkey (19:59)
You know?
So... Anyways. Yeah, that's my rant. Well, let's get back to you. ⁓ I had some fun questions. Did you see the questions, by the way? Cool. And we've been narrowing them down because some of them are more fun than others, and we've added a couple on. ⁓ But... don't hold back.
Daniel Siegelman (20:03)
Make sense.
Yes.
but they're very
interesting for a quick fire. I enjoyed listening to some of them already and reading through these, I'm like, man, I got so many. I got to pick a good one for each one of these.
Josh Sharkey (20:28)
Well, let's start with the greatest dish you ever ate at a restaurant.
Daniel Siegelman (20:32)
Very easy. ⁓ It was a roast suckling pig under a laminated pasta with a sauce garbiche and mustard beurre blanc that was at the French Laundry in 2011. I'll never forget that dish.
Josh Sharkey (20:42)
Oof.
Why that one?
Daniel Siegelman (20:46)
It was...
technically incredible.
⁓ The way they presented it they came out table side with the suckling pig, know, perfectly crispy Laminated amazing brought it back to the kitchen and then you just got presented this beautiful sheep Sheeted pasta laminate with all these edible flowers and herbs tarragon With this, deconstructed sauce garbiche on top and then you just go right into it and you have all that nice Succulent just you know, the pig was perfect. The mustard had a perfect acidity It's just like it's one of those bites that you eat it and you're like, I want this not to stop
ever and unfortunately it did
Josh Sharkey (21:22)
Yeah, that's interesting. There's
Grbysh and Berblanc. I would never have thought of those things together.
Daniel Siegelman (21:29)
It was little wild, you know. ⁓ Yeah, yeah. And I've tried to replicate that dish time and time again. ⁓ So I, closest I've got was using with pork belly, you know, kind of can't really go out to a store and get a suckling pig down here. So, but it's definitely that's one of the top dishes I've ever had.
Josh Sharkey (21:30)
Yeah, well I guess the Brabant's probably for the pasta to... That's interesting.
Yeah
Yeah.
Alright, cool. I love Gribiche, man. Just that, that like category of sauces, Gribiche, remoulade, tartare, they're like, you know, you get the capers, you get the mayo, it's so good. People don't use that a I actually make Gribiche at home a lot, you know, just with some veggies. Yeah. It's just like, it works with so many things.
Daniel Siegelman (22:01)
Mm-hmm.
Go Verso. That's great.
It's incredible just like the we talked about you know salsa macha people don't really understand what it is You know I'm not here to you know teach a customer What something is so if we have to change the name of a sauce just for them to try it like we're my kids You know that's what we'll do and you know they're like all this is really good
Josh Sharkey (22:26)
Yeah. Yeah.
All right. So, Chef, that should get way more shout outs than they do.
Daniel Siegelman (22:39)
You probably know this gentleman, ⁓ Alex Lee from Danielle. He was our corporate chef at Steven Star when I was there.
Sitting down talking to him about his stories and everybody that you know He's worked with and how he transcends all his knowledge on you. It's pretty powerful ⁓ he's he's a man of amongst men and a chef amongst chefs and You know every time I see him pop up on instagram I just like I go into a doom scroll on him see what has been up to recently You know spending time in the kitchen with him was absolutely amazing ⁓ you know, he's he is a big name guy. A lot of people know him But I had to pick someone that no one really knows i'm gonna go with john sergi
Josh Sharkey (22:56)
He's a legend.
Daniel Siegelman (23:18)
⁓ him and I have spent a lot of time together through star, ⁓ you know, through the recent company I'm with right now and he just moved up and he's overseeing the war Eagle room in Auburn. ⁓ you know, he's someone that if you're having a tough day in the kitchen, he'll just talk to you and you're just, you're going to have the perfect service right afterwards. he's super knowledgeable and really humble, ⁓ a younger chef and just really honored and eager to get out there and just kind of change the world wherever he can. So, you know, shout out to John.
Josh Sharkey (23:45)
Love it. Alright.
John Surgey. Got it. Cool. Do you ever see that, by the way, speaking of Alex, did you ever see that episode of Follow That Food with Balsamic? You with Acheto Balsamico? You do you remember Follow That Food? was the guy that did Millionaire, whatever. You know who I'm talking about? The guy that also did like, The Riches. What's his name? Oh my God.
Daniel Siegelman (23:49)
Yep.
Josh Sharkey (24:15)
⁓ Nah, it's a little bit older. I don't know if we're the same, if you and I are the same age, but like, ⁓ I'll think, but anyway, I'll have to try and search for this thing, but he did this, he was a really cool show, and basically they would like pick a food and then they would follow it around. So like I tried to bossamico, he went to Italy, to Modena, saw how they produced it, ⁓ and then he, ⁓ I'm Googling it right now.
Daniel Siegelman (24:15)
Phil?
Josh Sharkey (24:44)
And then he would go to like a place in Modena where they're like, you know, using it like traditionally, and then they would like go to around the world. So then he went to Danielle. um, and, and, and they did a soft shell crab with, with, uh, with balsamic and it was, uh, whatchamacallit, um, Alex Lee doing this, like a balsamic dish. What is the name? I'll have to, I have to remember that. I'll try, I'll try to see if I can find it, but, uh, um, man, his like, his name is like, I'm just spacing.
Daniel Siegelman (25:03)
That's great.
I'm interested in seeing what that is.
Josh Sharkey (25:14)
Gordon something. When people hear this game, like, dude, you didn't remember this? ⁓ anyways. ⁓ All right, cool. So next, and I'm gonna switch these around a little bit. ⁓ And I actually didn't send this one to you. So top two most wasted ingredients in the kitchen.
Daniel Siegelman (25:25)
Hit me.
I'd say any stock or green top for root vegetable. Highly wasted, super nutrient dense. You look at broccoli stems, carrot tops. think nowadays people don't understand the usage of them and how we can incorporate that into a disc, especially getting 100 % yield on something. ⁓ The other one I would say definitely any kind of fat that comes off of a braise.
So if you're braising short ribs, know, lot of people remove the fat and just take the, you know, the jelly on the bottom, turn that into a sauce, but why don't we use that fat? Why don't we baste other meats or, you know, use that for another component in a dish? It's, it's super flavorful if it done right. I think that's, you know, it's a big miss in our community.
Josh Sharkey (26:17)
Interesting. You know, I remember using the lobster fat from like making lobster stock I never used the fat from from short ribs. That's interesting for like from braises. Oxtail always has a ton of fat. That would be a
Daniel Siegelman (26:26)
So for
yeah, anything gelatinous like that, you know, we do our carnitas, we use our carnitas fat, the form into our tamales. So it's, we use a lot of that kind of cross utilization. But there's a lot of other things that you know, you just see it, you're like, why are you scraping it off and throwing it out, man? That's so good.
Josh Sharkey (26:45)
That's so
smart. Wow. I haven't heard that one. We heard the stems a lot, obviously, but the fat from braises is that super, yeah, because it's got all that flavor too. ⁓ What else do use it for? So you put in the the the masa, what else you use the fat for?
Daniel Siegelman (26:50)
Yeah.
absolutely. Absolutely.
I've used it to, you know, based meats or, you know, kind of like gently brush fish to get a nice like depth of flavor onto it. ⁓ You know, cook chicken in it, pan sear chicken in it to kind of get that more earthy tones to it. Basically anything, anything you use like a butter or fat to it, like to try and incorporate different flavors. So, you know, I've I've sous vide carrots playing around with it and ⁓ short rib fat. So get a little bit more smoky flavor to it. You know, it's just I just play around with it and see what works, what doesn't work.
Josh Sharkey (27:12)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
that's smart,
Daniel Siegelman (27:32)
you know, some of the greatest things happen by accident. So in our field, so it's definitely, you know, why not?
Josh Sharkey (27:35)
Huh? Yeah.
It's so funny, I actually just wrote, I started writing a little bit and I wrote this, ⁓ like a post last week about just ways where we we find flavor, know, where like things like this. ⁓ And I remember, you know, John George, they used to like rest the meat in oil, would like a veal loin or something, they would like rest it in oil. like, that's really smart if it's the right temp.
Daniel Siegelman (28:03)
Yeah.
Josh Sharkey (28:04)
But I bet you could do the same with the short rib fat. If you're cooking a steak and then instead of resting it just on a rack, you just rest it in the short rib fat. Because the moisture doesn't escape. yeah. Super smart. It's a good one, All right. If you could ban one ingredient, tool, or phrase in the kitchen, what would it be?
Daniel Siegelman (28:14)
Yes, immunity as well as butter best. Thank you.
Heard.
Josh Sharkey (28:31)
could be on that too. It's so funny because you hear people say one or the other. They're either like, I hate We Chef or I hate Behind, I want Herd. And they like, you know, or like, it's like either We Chef or Herd and like people would be either like one or the other.
Daniel Siegelman (28:41)
Yeah.
I think for me, hurt is just they say it just to say it, but they're not grasping what you're calling.
So it's just like in ear and just bounces out doesn't even go through and they just want to be heard Versus calling something back if you call something back It's kind of like etched in your memory and it's gonna sit there If you should say heard like you forget two seconds later what that call was or what's going on and you're just back to your La La Land So that that to me that needs to go away. I mean, I said it a lot as a young as a young cook and chef Trust me. I'm not I'm not saying I'm immune to it. I was I was a heard king back in a day, but
Josh Sharkey (29:09)
Yeah, yeah.
⁓ so you-
Yeah.
Daniel Siegelman (29:21)
You for now as you grow and you start really compartmentalizing and looking at the philosophy of ⁓ Heard to me. It's just like a all right got it. Thanks. You leave me alone
Josh Sharkey (29:31)
Yeah, that's,
you know, it's interesting though because I usually hear this in the context of, ⁓ I don't like herd, I like Wechef instead or something like that. But I like your point is that you actually want them to call back what you said. So if you're like fire to duck, you want to hear back like to duck. Got it, I like that. Super smart. All right. ⁓ At one point, I hope this next one gets some less than G rated answers. I have a lot of like,
R-rated answers here, but we'll see what you go with. Wildest or most embarrassing kitchen story?
Daniel Siegelman (30:09)
I don't want Peter to come after me for this one. Yeah. That this one I still have PTSD from ⁓ I was out. Am I allowed to call and talk about the restaurant I was at? Because it's formulated my career. All right. I was at Bottega. I was a sous chef for Michael Chiarello, know, rest in peace, chef. ⁓
Josh Sharkey (30:11)
I got a couple for that too, by the way.
You can say whatever you want.
Daniel Siegelman (30:31)
What a hell of a chef, but I was getting into the ordering I just became a sous chef and you know was working probably 16 18 hour days back in 2009 2010 and You know before the cell phones and we were calling in to calling produce orders and seafood orders It was around like midnight 1 a.m The chefs were at a roundtable meeting at the first table right in the middle of dining room talking about the next day And I'm getting the orders in I'm exhausted so I call the call the seafood order in hang up and
and I go flip through my orders and I go to call the produce order, but I call the seafood guy again. And I'm sitting here, I'm calling the produce and he's saying, yep, sure. No problem. No problem. The problem he goes, Hey, go tell Kiarello. No, I got his two club baby seal. I did about eight pounds each. You if he wants them, got two. I can get them out there tomorrow. I'm like,
I'm the new guy, I got this for him, great. So I run out, go to the chef, someone, hey guys, know, so and so seafood company, they have the two club baby seal. And they just stopped and they just looked at me like, man, you're dumb, you are from the East Coast and that just, that solidified. I'm like, ⁓ man. So they got me good with that one, so.
Josh Sharkey (31:42)
How long did it take you to realize, like, shit, just did some...
Daniel Siegelman (31:48)
When I saw Kirill's face look up at me and just his mouth open. I don't know, I thought that was something unique out there. We didn't have internet out there back then. It's just like, couldn't Google like what's a club baby seal. Like, I don't know. I was naive 23 year old kid.
Josh Sharkey (32:02)
Yeah.
Yeah, I've done some dumb things. remember like my... Long before I got into professional kitchens, when I was 16, I worked at Don Pablo's. I remember I worked in the kitchen, but then I decided to do some like front of house stuff too, just to see. And my first day, they were like, okay, just now we need to go water all the plants. And there's a ton of them. So it took like 30 minutes, water all the plants. And then I got done and they were laughing. I was like, what? And I had...
They're all fucking fake plants.
Daniel Siegelman (32:33)
Yeah
That's good.
Josh Sharkey (32:37)
Yeah,
and by the way, that has not happened again in my life. One of my now-wife, girlfriend of the time, moved into my apartment. We went away on a trip, and I was like, gotta make sure we have somebody to come water the plant. And she's like, what? I was like, yeah, we gotta water the bamboo plant. And she's like, dude, that's a fake plant. I was like, I've been watering this for too much.
Someone gave it to me so Yeah, I got an issue there. All right so You have two kids. This would be a good one for you. How do you make your grilled cheese and get really specific? I want brand names. I want type and I want basically as detailed as you can get
Daniel Siegelman (33:08)
That's funny.
I'm a very simple guy from North Jersey and we use a lot of iron ore up there. So I'm very prone to cast iron. I love it. Yep. So I'm, I'm old school Texas toast, straight Texas toast, a big thick up, up there is ACME or shop, right? No, just you're playing like.
Josh Sharkey (33:31)
iron ore? iron, gotcha. ⁓
Where do you get text host from?
Yeah, gotcha.
Daniel Siegelman (33:47)
A lot of chemicals in that bread, nothing unique, nothing crazy, just simple white bread. A lot of butter on the outside, Kraft singles, and a slow cook and a cast iron, that's it. If it's cold out, probably four to six. If I'm doing something that day, I'll go two to three. It's full coverage, full coverage.
Josh Sharkey (33:49)
Yep.
Access to host.
Yep.
How many singles? How many pieces?
Ooh, that's a lot dude. Wow. How many do you,
for your kids, how many do you do?
Daniel Siegelman (34:12)
They don't like, they don't like grilled cheese.
Josh Sharkey (34:16)
Really? You know, my son doesn't, my daughter, actually no, he does. He doesn't grilled cheese. And I remember making grilled cheese, my wife and I, I asked this question by the way, because like, I make a grilled cheese, you know, in a pan, I'm like searing it, you know, like butter. My wife makes it in the convection oven. And the first time I started making it, she said, what are you doing? And because she's used to making the convection oven. Anyways, I made it, but I put two slices in. She's like, what are what are two slices? They're kids. I was like, who doesn't put two slices of,
Daniel Siegelman (34:41)
Ha ha.
Josh Sharkey (34:45)
cheese and a grilled cheese. That's insane. But yeah, I've never heard four to six. That's a lot. I mean, like, yeah, that's true if it's Texas toast.
Daniel Siegelman (34:48)
It's not grilled bread, it's grilled cheese.
Well, the Texas toast, mean, it's a big guy.
You you got to have a good ratio there.
Josh Sharkey (34:59)
Yeah, do you cover the pan or you just do it and do you do it whole or do do it like two slices and then? Yeah
Daniel Siegelman (35:01)
No. No, do a hole. Do a hole.
Let the heat come through. It's probably four minutes each side.
Josh Sharkey (35:08)
Butter on the bread and the pan or just on the bread?
Daniel Siegelman (35:11)
Just on the bread.
Josh Sharkey (35:13)
Any salt on the bread when it comes off? Gotcha. Yeah, okay.
Daniel Siegelman (35:15)
Nope, Kraft is salty enough.
Like I said, very simple. I'm not gonna, I'm a simple guy.
Josh Sharkey (35:20)
All right.
Yeah. Well, those are the six that are the best. I have a few more. Let me see what time it is. How much time we got left. But I'll be honest, the ones that, like the other ones, weren't, like, just haven't been hitting as much. So I'll give you the option. So we have time for one more question. And I sent you a few. I sent you like a technique, a recipe you borrowed or you still use today. A dish that never made it on the menu. First thing to break down on the scale or something you learned from.
Daniel Siegelman (35:50)
Mm.
Josh Sharkey (35:54)
Basically something you learn from a boss who, like, didn't do it right. Why don't you pick one of those?
Daniel Siegelman (36:00)
Let's go with something I learned from Boston Indoor, right? ⁓ Just, you know, for our younger generation chefs and cooks out there coming up. ⁓ I think it's important that if you get hired to do your job, do your job 100 % of the time, all the time, even when no one's looking. ⁓ And also the micromanaging, if you got hired to come on and do something,
Let them shine, let them do their job. If not, they're never gonna grow or, you know, fail at something to get better. ⁓ I think that's very important, especially in our community. It's, you you have to fail to learn. And if you're being micromanaged to a point where you can't grow, that's a problem. I think we're at a stalemate in our industry with that.
Josh Sharkey (36:45)
Yeah, was there something that happened in your past that you can remember where this came up for you?
Daniel Siegelman (36:52)
There's a few instances, ⁓ you know.
not the name names or anything like that, or anybody on the bus, but I did have my challenges growing up and saying, all right, now you're in charge of this, do it like this. And I would do it and I found a better way. So I'd approach the owner or the chef and be like, hey, here's a more effective way to do it. And you're like, no, I don't want to do it like that. It's my way. But now like the labor is increasing, your food cost is going up just because you have an ego, but you're not looking at the overall picture. That's definitely it's it's stunted my
Josh Sharkey (37:22)
Yeah.
Daniel Siegelman (37:25)
growth in my career younger, a lot younger, but you learn to push through it and you know you see the you see their version of it as you grow and get into their positions and why they chose to do so. ⁓ It happens more often than not and it's not really talked about.
Josh Sharkey (37:42)
Yeah, yeah, I agree. You know, it's interesting too. I think the most poignant part about that for me is is the let them shine or really let them fail too because you know, we have kids, you know, like ⁓ The only way they learn the only way they actually learn that like that thing's gonna spill if you knock it off the table Is that they knock it off the table once and they see man. I just spilled my milk all over the carpet That's what happens if I you know, and if you don't let you know people fail one They won't truly learn
And if it does fail, then they'll own it way more than if you did it begrudgingly or didn't let them because then it's on them and they can actually take ownership of their decisions. It's more risk and it's more fear to give some control away. But it always resonates with me, especially now that I have kids and also as a starting a whole new...
uh, career, right? You know, outside of the kitchen as a, you know, as a tech entrepreneur, there are things that people told me, like before I started, like people that have done this for a very long time. And I was like, yeah, that makes sense. But I didn't, I thought I understood it, but I didn't. And the only way I could really understand it was to screw it up and then realize, oh shit, that's, that's why that's important. And like a hundred people told me the thing. Um,
Daniel Siegelman (38:42)
Yeah.
Josh Sharkey (39:07)
And you you can't ever really like learn something until you do it yourself. know, like you can't learn like lessons, know, and principles unless you experience them yourselves. somebody could tell you a million times, don't do that, but you gotta know why, you know, and I feel like you feel it way more when you do it.
Daniel Siegelman (39:12)
Exactly.
Yeah, no, I agree with you 100%. You know, putting your hands on it and really getting in there and figuring out yourself. Like you said with kids, you put your foot out when you're riding a bike. If not, you'll wonder why I told you to do so. So.
Josh Sharkey (39:38)
Yeah, yeah, and by the way,
might, you might not, and then you'll see and you'll really hurt your ankle and be like, shit, I should have done that. Yeah, it's interesting with kids though, because they still get mad at you. They're like, you know, like, you can't tell them I told you. yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, this morning, like my son was playing, like, like they wake us up early and he jumped in bed and then he started tickling my, our feet, my wife's feet and ⁓
Daniel Siegelman (39:42)
Yeah.
Hey look, you can ride a bike now. Great!
⁓ it is not. We're in the thick of it right now. I'm always wrong no matter what.
Josh Sharkey (40:06)
She accidentally like, you know, reacted like it was a jerk reaction and like hit his face and he just started bawling and You know in my head I'm like, well man, you know you tickle the bear But you can't you know, but I promise you he's not gonna tickle her feet that way
Daniel Siegelman (40:10)
You
Yeah.
As we like to say in the kitchen, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Josh Sharkey (40:27)
I like that one. That was awesome. Well, this was great, man. I'm so stoked you got the chance to come on here. ⁓
Daniel Siegelman (40:35)
No, thank
you very much. This is actually my first one. thanks for doing that to me. It is great. It's an honor to meet you. You're doing so much for our community and the chef world. And I really appreciate what you and your team are doing and really getting us, you know.
Josh Sharkey (40:38)
really? Very cool. Well you did... Yeah, you did great.
Daniel Siegelman (40:51)
back into the kitchens and off of recipe templates. to be able to be more in line with our customers and our food and our recipes, instead of really trying to like sit there and hand write everything out, I really appreciate you and your team for what you're doing. I just hope, I've spread Me's out to all my chef friends. You guys gotta check this out. So it's something unique. There are other formats out there and software, but yours is probably the most user-friendly, the training aspect on it.
you know, it's something I'm advocating for you. So congratulations and thank you for everything.
Josh Sharkey (41:24)
Well, thank
you. I'm grateful. I'm grateful that especially coming from you, it means a lot. So thanks, man. Yep. Stay on. I always forget to say this because it's got a little.
Daniel Siegelman (41:31)
Absolutely,
